Linda Besh is an authorized #IngressSwag dealer.....the first and only so be looking for her at events for your ...
Linda Besh is an authorized #IngressSwag dealer.....the first and only so be looking for her at events for your #IngressGear and other cool stuff.
#IngressWear
#IngressWear
Thanks for the 411
ReplyDeleteHonest question:
ReplyDeleteDoes this mean Google will be cracking down on unauthorized derivative works based on or including Niantic/Google intellectual property?
ToS already forbids it, but… we all know that not all that legalese is actually enforced.
Chris Koch Yes they've already started,We love the agent generated stuff but any of our stuff is a no no without an OK.
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley Is there a means for gaining (pre)authorization for agent created swag? Or is this a dead end from now on?
ReplyDeleteChris Koch most likely not; this is a way for ppl to not have to worry about "shady" people.
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley what's "our stuff" you mean reselling niantic stuff?
ReplyDelete"Our stuff" would refer to trademarked logos etc....
ReplyDeleteEthan Lepouttre any change to https://support.google.com/ingress/answer/2924461?hl=en
ReplyDeleteSwag Cartel XMSwag
ReplyDeletewow it took you 2+ years to realize what we were asking for and you let us work for 2 years then you decide to stop us? #badform
ReplyDeleteWell, I know who I need to ask. :D
ReplyDeleteCapitalism at its finest.
ReplyDeleteSources tell me that formal clarifications from Niantic on the larger issue of swag production, licensing, and player-generated content are coming very soon. The main point of this should be read as "Someone will be selling swag at the con, and they have Niantic's blessing to do so ... but this is the only person authorized to sell official stuff right now."
ReplyDeleteDaniel Lawrence if they are still formalizing a process then how can Linda Besh be official?
ReplyDeletePaul Pawlowski are you being funny am I missing something?
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley i'm asking a ? how can someone be made official if there is no formal process? that would potentially open a company up to all sorts of issues.
ReplyDeletePaul Pawlowski what part of Linda Besh is authorized did you miss ?
ReplyDeleteMy understanding is that Linda is the first because they need to have a smoke test to iron out other potential issues and "clean up" the process before it's widely available.
ReplyDeleteThey KNOW the community wants it and are now in a position to grant that demand, and they're just meeting that demand carefully.
I know it's maddening - several groups of creators (of which you're in many) have been asking these same questions for months if not years - let's take a sign of actual motion on these issues as a positive thing, not something to decry.
I am curious and am looking forward to how they will address derivative works. How much modification is required from the original IP before its considered not in violation of infringement.
ReplyDeleteI think Paul Pawlowski has a good point. How can you make a third party an offical reseller if nothing has been agreed other than they can just sell their stuff.
ReplyDeleteYou can't just have a third party doing work for someone without something official in place otherwise all manner of stupid things might happen.
I think it is good on Niantic to start protecting their trademarks. I do have problems with people using the logos that are trademarked to make a profit. Keyword is profit.
ReplyDeleteChris Clifton sorry you guys lost the point here I was trying to help not complicate things and confuse you guys.This seems simple Linda has the OK to sell our stuff no one else has and jumping on my post does no one any good.
ReplyDeleteI think it's also important to remember that Niantic's always approved of player created swag as a free marketing device - they're just starting to get protective of their IP for two reasons (in my opinion): 1 - they're now selling stuff and don't want anyone getting scammed, and 2 - there are a number of people who have started setting up storefronts and for-profit businesses.
ReplyDeleteIn the case of the latter, when it's clearly artistic works that are only loosely derivative (for example caleb wood's masterful schematic drawings), there's a non-issue... but stores selling patches that cost $0.68 to produce that are literally near exact replicas of what Niantic produces, and then charging $5 for those patches so that people don't have to purchase a rare swag pack if all they want is the patch.... this undercuts directly with no derivative or artistic add. Where that line is drawn is (as Dean Nielson mentioned) a difficult question, and one that that is no doubt bearing significant discussion.
Even simpler, she has the right to be a point of sale for Niantic merchandise. If I understand it correctly, If you meet Linda, she can officially sell you swag on the spot in the name of Niantic.
ReplyDeleteYes you can, you have a contract with We agree not to sue you for selling our official merchandise and it's done. I'm not seeing where this entire thing is difficult to understand? She can sell official swag at events, she's been authorized by Niantic to do so. Pretty simple really and not as Legally tricky as you guys seem to be insinuating.
ReplyDelete/Interested.
ReplyDeleteSo this means things like challenge coins and agent cards can't produced without the consent of Niantic and a licensing agreement? That's gonna put a dent in all the cool stuff people are doing. Hope this is for the best.
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeletedaniel faulkner we don't make coin or design coins or any of the cool stuff(which we love)you guys make.This is stuff we design.
ReplyDeletedaniel faulkner i think that the coins being produced all have significant artistic value beyond what's trademarked by Niantic, so the risk is small... though it would be nice to have a formal guideline with good examples. Where it gets fuzzy are things like... laser cut steel keychains in the shape of the resistance key. Niantic doens't make them... but the logo with no derivation is clearly theirs. Or Resistance specific Persepolis patches where the only thing changed is a thread color selection to be blue on blue....
ReplyDeleteI think what agents are ultimately looking for is two things: a clear guideline, and a way to submit potential manufactured items for simple "make it" or "don't make it" responses where it's in the grey area.
Remember, also, that Niantic doesn't have a huge team to devote to tracking down individual items made to celebrate a first saturday even or an anomaly location; their interest here will be in protecting their IP from large shops, and in protecting the agents from unscrupulous vendors.
(for those of you wondering who the hell I am, I'm a moderator in the swag trading community and am regularly heavily involved in advising those who are producing swag ... what i'm conveying is based on long experiences having these discussion with various Niantic personnel who can't give "official" answers... because there are none. many of us are hoping that the above is an indication that this might change soon. this doesn't mean that i'm not incorrect above... they very well could prove me wrong ... but i'm not just spouting nonsense.)
ReplyDeleteI was wondering when this would happen. Reading the description of the fan site media pack, it makes it clear which logos are absolutely verboten for use by non-Niantic third parties. An enormous percentage of swag made by players falls into the explicitly stated "you are not authorized to use this image, in any form, for any reason" category.
ReplyDeleteKnowing what I know:
ReplyDelete1) Niantic has a real obligation to protect its IP. They are taking steps.
2) Niantic can authorize anyone (or nobody) to use their IP and sell their designs. They have have taken this step
3) There is a process on going to develop a means and licensing schemes needed to protect Niantic IP
4) Niantic has courteously notified the community of these changes
While we all love our Agent Created Swag (see Joe Philley response above), they have to take steps we might not like to protect their IP. The only issue is that we've have been given more access to create things and that is changing. Change sucks and yet is needed.
It will get sorted out, and we'll have better understanding as it does get sorted out. Personally, I see this as an opportunity for Niantic to do something they need to do (Protect their IP) while at the same time providing us something unique, access to protected IP (assuming they can sort it out this way).
I will be reserving judgement for now, giving Niantic the time and space needed to do what they need to do. Lets see if they also help keep some of the uniqueness of user created content as well.
IMHO, user created swag is part of the charm that Niantic has going for it with Ingress. I hope they find a way to keep it.
Thanks for the update Joe Philley!
ReplyDeleteSounds like a simple evolution of marketing strategy and Niantic attempting to keep people from profiting from their IP. Fan generated stuff ok... knocks offs bad. I'm down with that.
Linda Besh Joe Philley Does this mean we will have a point of sale for all anomalies and/or a rep at each? Satellite sites have always suffered from mission swag and such like relaying on players doing the distribution points and so never enough for turn out.
ReplyDeleteThis is what I know; copywrong.
ReplyDeleteSo she is the swagfairy! Yeiii
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteOf course we love the community and the game! The swag thing is just part of the natural evolution that the company needs to do to keep these things going
ReplyDeleteSo does this mean( for the time being) that I'll need to talk with Linda Besh for large standard Res/Enl patch orders? head scratch
ReplyDeleteI'd better get an exit strategy in place then ;)
ReplyDeleteJ Yu Can I spend your two cents? :p
ReplyDeleteYou say dealer, I say pusher! ;-) #SeeWhatIDidThere #TheFirstSwagIsFree
ReplyDeleteThank you Joe Philley for commenting and making things clearer. Was also confused but you answered all my questions. Can't wait to see what Linda Besh puts out
ReplyDeleteEthan Lepouttre On swag, I love the Cards peeps are making. And you guys have cards that give badges. What if there was another tab for peeps meet and then you could sell the opportunity to have cards with attached codes that give you peoples badges in the Peeps you have meet section?
ReplyDeleteJust a thought on a money spinner/unique thing you guys could do.
I like the idea but without being in a position to really say anything for or against. I worry if you wouldn't dilute the badges so much that they didn't carry the same value
ReplyDeletestrictly my opinion
Daniel Lawrence could I get some info on the swag making groups? I've had to be out of the game for two years, but I'm back in. I'm also a seamstress and embroider :)
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley thanks for letting us know clearly what we can and can't do.
ReplyDeleteIt would be really awesome if we had more attention at satellite sites and access to official swag. Then.... Maybe this would not be an issue in the first place. :D
Amber Peace hangout incoming
ReplyDeleteI have the one and only picture of Joe Philley smiling in Nashville ... hmmmm.... I will never trademark that! 😂😂😂
ReplyDeleteRemember Google spinoffs and side projects have so long to be profitable to the company or it will be shut down. Niantic needs to do these things for the game to continue as a whole and also to continue to be free.
ReplyDeleteEthan Lepouttre Possibly, but if you had a separate tab it could add to the discovery/community. Also, have mission badges added or diluted the badges? #JustWorkingOverTheIdea
ReplyDeleteWait, does this mean that Linda Besh is going to be giving people all those Ingress tattoos you see posted, too? :)
ReplyDeleteI've got a few tattoos from Linda Besh now. She's pretty good.
ReplyDeleteAnd Q-Workshop whose dice were advertised for Persepolis by Ingress/Niantic?
ReplyDeleteMelissa North they have a licence.
ReplyDeleteSennheiser. Decent buckets, those.
ReplyDeleteLinda Besh I'm game! I have some empty space left!
ReplyDeleteOn a serious note, Linda Besh, Ethan Lepouttre, Joe Philley... thank you guys (and gal) for all you do for us. Ingress wouldn't be the same without y'alls hard work and dedication.
That's just one smurfs $.02
/sub
ReplyDeleteDaniel Lawrence great explanation
ReplyDeleteEthan Lepouttre Linda Besh Joe Philley Daniel Lawrence thanks for all the great info it is glad to know that great people have our backs and are will to spread the info and Ethan Lepouttre when are you coming back to the east coast we miss you over here your van is trapped in Portland I can not link to it for vt
ReplyDeleteHopefully soon!
ReplyDeleteEthan Lepouttre awesome we love you out here
ReplyDeleteThat are good news, thanks alot!
ReplyDeleteBut pretty pretty please with puppy eyes: don't forget good ol' europe (asia and africa of course too).
We're addicted too and want to "invest" loooot of money for Swag ;)
/bookmark
ReplyDeleteMuch love for all you do. Congrats Linda Besh You are very worthy of being the first.
ReplyDeleteYeah what he said ☝☝☝👐👐👏👏👏👏👏👏
ReplyDeleteIs this a cease and desist order to all swag, certain swag, or just the individuals blatantly profiteering on the game?
ReplyDeleteThere are so many people selling cool unique designs that are quite commendable, regions unifying under a certain logo with shirts or other symbols that could be lost as a result. :/