Very easy If it has our logo its a no no
Very easy If it has our logo its a no no
https://support.google.com/ingress/answer/2924461?hl=en
https://support.google.com/ingress/answer/2924461?hl=en
"Despite the fact that we all know the risks involved, I am convinced that we should continue to investigate the...
"Despite the fact that we all know the risks involved, I am convinced that we should continue to investigate the value of high-dose-XM research." "We should view 'Epiphany Night' not as a crisis, but a tremendous opportunity." Dr. Victor Kureze, in an email last week. -PAC #ingress http://www.nianticproject.com http://www.nianticproject.com
So we can't use the eye, the key or the triangle-hexagon thingy. At all. Or derivatives thereof.
ReplyDeleteHave I got that right?
So that would make an awful lot of stuff that's already out there ... contraband. Is there a "grandfather clause" on this for things like coins and such that are already out of production or are the lawyers going to confiscate them?
the eye, the key or the triangle-hexagon thingy(and any our our brands) are ours.This is like a shot across the bow new stuff will be targeted.
ReplyDeleteThis is essentially one of the largest things that makes the community what it is. "Swag" is a very serious thing for some people. Unless Niantic intends on creating coins, shirts, pants, mangas, "player cards" for every player that requests them.. etc. ... it's going to be something near-impossible to really crack down on.
ReplyDeleteUnless, of course, someone is using the brand on a wide scale (a whole store dedicated to Ingress swag, for example).
Nothing is easy. This is going to be messy.
ReplyDeleteOuch there goes the swag addicts worst nightmare :(
ReplyDeleteDoes this include original art that implements ingress logos? Community logos, etc?
ReplyDeleteSteve Schwaller we plan on having everything you guys need and licensing for stuff we have someone on it.
ReplyDeletesubscribing : )
ReplyDeleteGo on then, start suing the players who run fan websites and swag sites. You will lose a lot of respect for that. I will call your bluff on that one, I don't think you will ever do that, unless you want a bad rep on the internet.
ReplyDeleteIf I was you niantec, I would follow the Grateful Dead approach to merchandising/taping concerts, and go for Viral Marketing to promote the brand. Let the players do what they want in that respect. It benefits you on Marketing because the players are doing it for you.
The more people looking at the Niantec Ingress brand benefits your sponsors, softbank, MUFG, AXA, etc, it's in their interests to have more players playing ingress.
You want to gain more players, not threaten them and put people off. I'm kind of appalled that you've come up with this post Joe Philley
1 good fan website probably equates to an additional 100-500 extra players. Before you start going for a two footed tackle on fan websites, look at other online game approaches towards player's fan websites first...
Whatever you do, do not go after the Fan Generated swag, we will hate you for it. The swag is usually made not for profit anyway.
Oh, please! Joe Philley There are lots of local resitance and enlightend groups, that use the logos for t-shirt, caps, etc. Shall we burn these things now?
ReplyDeleteNiantic has to protect what is theirs to make money and sustain the game. The policy has been there since the beginning, but players took liberty with swag creation because there was never enough. I'm looking forward to seeing what Niantic has to offer.
ReplyDeleteSorry Niantec, you we're way to slow on your own merchandising store, which should have been there from day 1 and now you're waving this card at us?
ReplyDeleteI think the info on how communities could license things so they can make local swag should have been available before the don't do it or the lawyers come. I trust that there will be a process but the timing of the info is making it messy.
ReplyDeleteMartin Treadgold They had to work within Google's guidelines. Now that they're on their own, they have the liberty to create their own storefront and monetize how they'd like.
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley it might be helpful to update that "Brand and Fan Site Guidelines" page with the contact for licensing as soon as possible. It might save much wailing and gnashing of teeth.
ReplyDeleteGood thing there are parody rights prepare for ingress parody swag
ReplyDeleteBrad Howard yes please give us time on this I'm just giving and FYI
ReplyDeleteI'm just here to watch the shit storm!!
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley exactly how long did it or didn't it take you to come with this and have your handlers approved this.
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteAgain, you find another way to take the fun out of the game.
ReplyDeleteI am thinking this is the first step towards exclusivity of swag creation for Nia. Let's hope it is better than portal review....
ReplyDeleteA parody is a work that ridicules another, usually well-known work, by imitating it in a comic way. Judges understand that, by its nature, parody demands some taking from the original work being parodied. Unlike other forms of fair use, a fairly extensive use of the original work is permitted in a parody in order to “conjure up” the original. - See more at: http://fairuse.stanford.edu/overview/fair-use/what-is-fair-use/#sthash.zTSJEs6R.dpuf
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteI love Ingress and want to see you guys profit and thrive. I've made some great friends thanks to you, and I'm not interested in seeing the party end any time soon. :)
ReplyDeleteI would like to see a process for licensing at a reasonable cost or percentage that allows the existing producer community to continue to sell to us online. I know that I can't make all the events to buy things in person and I know I'm not alone.
Further, swag produced by locals hosting official events, such as anomaly sites and First Saturdays, is used to offset their own expenses for hosting such events. Since I do love to attend things when I can, I would hate for it to become too expensive for communities to want to host such things. I would also love to see official Niantic swag available for purchase by organizers at a low cost so that they can afford to distribute something small, like a patch, for free to FS attendees.
/Dom
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley I would pay for licensing to reproduce licensed swag. I'm not sure how much it costs. But if reasonable it would make sense. Otherwise I'll have to be more creative.
ReplyDeleteI'm interested in being licensed too. I'm looking forward to seeing the information when its ready.
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley you say and other brands/logos... can there be a full list of what is a no so we can assume all others are a yes? I have no intrest in taking money from your pockets, but as the emotion in these comments show there is a lot of passion for community based merc.
ReplyDelete/sub :o
ReplyDelete"The Black Market of Ingress Swag." 😛
ReplyDelete/sub I support this and hope licensing is clear and easy to implement.
ReplyDeleteFor those targeting Joe Philley , he is just the messenger, don't shoot the messenger.
ReplyDelete/s
ReplyDeleteDoes this mean that Niantic is going to start enforcing their other rules too ?
ReplyDeleteSo, basically, "thanks for all the free marketing you guys have done... Now go away."
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley I don't blame you guys for going this route. It makes sense...you feel you need to control your brand. Just please allow the creativity of the Ingress community to flourish. Let people license making their own swag for their friends and people across the world. I would hate to see all the cool stuff people have made and will make, go away.
ReplyDeleteChris Whissen sorry you miss the point here.
ReplyDeleteNiantic is smart to make a vocal claim to protect their intellectual property. If a rights holder doesn't make steps (even small ones) to protect their rights, they lose those rights.
ReplyDeleteIf this is going to become more of a money making operation, by the selling of official swag does this mean that players will have more avenues of recourse when NIA screws up? Say for instance when a valid portal with a blocker is removed from the game? Even when said portal meets acceptance criteria and when a representative of the game states the portal will be reinstated when the area is "open" (ie. when it's no longer strategically important)?
ReplyDeleteThis should be veerrrrry interesting...
ReplyDeleteexactly Ryan Tiedeman
ReplyDeleteWe all knew this was coming. It's just that not having the licensing procedure ready to go before announcing it was kind of clumsy.
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley So this may fall under the grey area.. What about all the teams/regions worldwide that have keys or enl eyes on/in their logos? how are they going to identify themselves without associating in game imagery that has come to stick over the past 2 years? (other then a "hi im green, hi im blue."
ReplyDeleteHAHAHAHA joke of the week right here
ReplyDeletethis does not include things such as personal gifts or personal items that one makes and does not sell for profit...
ReplyDeleteTime to kill off my redbubble site then...
ReplyDeleteI'm glad the Ingress and NIA can now actually market product without the other rules and guidelines as before.
ReplyDeleteThe tape for this particular endeavor is gone.
They are simply asking for our respect when creating products from here on out, nothing more.
AKA, dont be a douche.
/s
ReplyDeleteI don't get the big deal here. So you can't use some other artist's work. Why is that a bad thing? Create your own stuff. #PonyRiders did. Seemed to work for us.
ReplyDeleteGiancarlo S thats my question too right there. For all the worldwide teams whom have modifications of the ENL/RES logos incorporating/ alongside with imagery in their respective cities/towns/states
ReplyDeleteYeah, the clause for not using the logos have been there since the very beginning. Funny, though, how many people got an invite by creating art using those logos (publicity). Then, certain sites hosting player made swag were given a cese and decist in the beginning (Etsy).
ReplyDeleteThen, for some strange reason it was magically OK to make whatever you want. This created a huge community of Pokemon-esqe creators and players. Chop it up to Google unable to stop the train. Or, the cost/benefit of the publicity created by the talented set of creators this game attracts.
Either way, Niantic/Google saw no profit from these endeavours while providing an (almost) ad free, purchase free, free-to-play game. And I'm willing to bet a good handful of people have enjoyed some monetary gain from their efforts. Fund-raisers and handouts aside, I know I've paid way more for something than it costs to make/ship on a couple occasions.
Licencing is not a bad thing if done right. I just hope Niantic will go the extra mile in an area where other companies seem to dismally fail...Communicate!!! Efficiently, Effectively and Responsively.
/sub. Want to know how this will affect community based logo swag
ReplyDeleteKaren Brown it should not affect it, we love the stuff just blatant knock offs and the such
ReplyDeletethats a lot of logos you need to chase down after 2 years of doing nothign about it.
ReplyDeleteI think we should all have a sit down and have a proper chat between Niantec and the players on how Niantec should make money.
ReplyDeleteWe do want to help you make money of course, because we need this game to keep going.
We want Anomalies, Events, game development, Ingress Reports. But now that you're on you own, you're losing money fast.
So what's your business model now? I'm struggling to see how you are actually making money, apart from sponsorships from AXA, MUFG, Softbank..
1st Revenue stream for Niantec should be Subscription, nominal fee of 5 Euros per year per login. (yes should be only 1 login) This also benefits players, as it discourages fake accounts, and probably will put an end to spoofing.
2nd Revenue Stream for Niantec would be more sponsorship deals... but actually with companies that the players have heard of. for example, I still have no intention of dealing with softbank or MUFG.. although could be likely I might deal with AXA insurance one day. I don't mind seeing more items ingame that are sponsored. I can live with that
3rd Revenue Stream, yes you need a merchandise webstore. But then again, we need our fan based Merchandise too. Just selling Merchandise at anomalies isn't enough, and from what I saw at the anomalies, the merchandise wasn't that appealing. This is why fan generated merchandise is appearing because it is more fun, attractive, relevant. Sorry I just don't want a dice set, looks nice, but I have no use for it.... but if you started selling the Ingress Anker Battery packs as a merchandise deal, then now you're talking..
But at the moment, fan based Merchandise sites have the better swag, you need to step up and make better swag than the players make. And fan based merchandising is a free way of marketing and advertising for Niantec anyway.
For starters, I want to see all official patches, pins etc for sale.
4th Revenue Stream, Pay 5 Euros to register for an anomaly... which in turn unlocks the Anomaly Medals.
5th Revenue Stream, Start selling Passcode cards for VRLA, and other such things..
6th.. Pay for an unlock of extra 1000 item space.. I know most players would chop off their left arm to have this.. perhaps bundle it in with the 1st revenue stream..
And so on..
There's a lot we would tolerate in terms of financing the game, as long as it is fair, but don't go after the fan sites or fan merch please.
/sub
ReplyDeleteQuestion for clarification. I run a G+ group that features an image that includes a Resistance key. I also run a cross-faction group with similar usage of the logos that say "Please refrain from using these trademarks and logos on your websites, social media sites, or on other items in a way that creates confusion"
ReplyDeleteIf I put a disclaimer in the header of my G+ groups stating they are not officially affiliated with Niantic or Ingress, may I continue to use them as long as I have taken those steps to prevent causing confusion?
Kirk Shaw it clearly says don't do it with new stuff.
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley I know you guys have to make money and will grant that my comment was reductive. But that's really how the guidelines come across. The players are your best marketing team. Posters, business cards, fan sites, shirts, patches, flags, etc. Particularly without the Resistance key and Enlightened thing, all the work over the last two years is wasted. All the marketing we did for Ingress is suddenly under threat of a legal action. Pieces that your own team rewarded and reshared online, by the way.
ReplyDeleteThe point may not be intended as a middle finger to your players, but right now it sure as heck feels that way. Maybe it won't once full details are released, so I will try to draw back my initial judgment and wait for full word.
Your heads up is appreciated, but right now this really doesn't feel good. Here's hoping better word is coming soon.
+nate hoy You are confusing me, that is a no-no please remove the key logo
ReplyDeleteMartin Treadgold
ReplyDeletePlease add intelligent things to the conversation, not stupidity.
Martin Treadgold keep dreaming
ReplyDeleteNate Hoy the guidelines around G+ community logos have been there for about 2.5 years
ReplyDelete/S
ReplyDeleteKaren Brown it will affect community swag, don't let his PR stunt trick you.
ReplyDeleteGiancarlo S thats what I'm hoping for (as im sure many others!)
ReplyDeleteWilliam TNSheep look who is talking ;)
ReplyDeleteThe beginning of the end...
ReplyDeleteRaymond Andrews of course they won't enforce other TOS rules.. those cost them money rather than make them money.
ReplyDeleteKaren Brown Understood. But so have the guidelines about not selling items. I want to make sure I am in compliance, and I'm not a lawyer (nor do I want to have to pay to hire one).
ReplyDeleteI'm just looking for someone who knows to weigh in - if I include one or more of the 4 Niantic "please do not use in a way that causes confusion" as part of a larger logo for a G+ group, and include a disclaimer on my G+ group that says "not affiliated with Niantic", is this sufficient to keep me from causing confusion?
Or should I rework my logo to use one of the ten "approved" logos?
there are a bunch of people that cannot see this as they are blocked from Joe posts.
ReplyDeletetrolololol, but anyways, NIA sucks at handling every aspect of this game.. y'all think this will be different?
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley how do I go about getting a license? I love making swag and have always wanted to make it official while making it beneficial for you. I am very creative and have lots of skills, and would even be willing to work for Niantic as a swag creator if needs be. I just want to keep doing what I love :)
ReplyDeleteI guess the key is to NOT use one of the biggies - no Ingress logo, no eye, no key. Use your own community logo - if its far enough removed from the originals that people just KNOW you're not official, or one of the approved community logos that have been around for years.
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteNiantec need to make money, we need them to make money to keep the game going. Just saying, should they so wish to make money in the examples I highlighted, I am willing to go with the flow on that one.
ReplyDeleteIt's actually a standard business model of most other online computer games... e.g. League of Legends in game purchases for example, star wars the old republic etc
But I just don't think clamping down on the free viral marketing that the fan based sites provide, is a resource that Niantec want to lose..
If anyone has any better ideas on how Niantec should make money, say so now..
My opinion is ..... stuff like the lighters and the USB drives that are currently on offer will be targeted. Patches with a community logo that includes a key or an eye that are carefully designed, will be ok.
ReplyDeleteHow do you know that you are in fact gay? /sub a post without imput. Ya'll Sheep!
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley I sent you a PM on Hangouts
ReplyDeleteThe cool part about licensing the logos is that you're free to sell it at a profit.
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteOh this will not end well.
ReplyDeleteWe aren't trying to crack down on city faction creating shirts to promote themselves (we like that)
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley Take the Baltimore Helios Anomaly tshit I have seen you wear, I utilized elements from the Helios Anomaly logo as well as the Res Key and the Antique Niantic hot air balloon when I designed it. Is that enough of a derivative work to be considered not in violation?
ReplyDeleteNiantic Labs is a good company full of remarkably smart and good hearted people who are just trying to get things right. I'm proud of them that they are now independent! Every player has helped them get this far and I'm confident that hasn't been forgotten. It's all a work in progress.
ReplyDeletePut down the pitchforks and give things a little time; is the announcement that they are independent even a week old yet? Lol It's gonna be ok!
I think what Joe is talking about are blatant reproductions of Niantic designs. Like, for example, making a patch using only the November Lima logo shown in the scanner. I don't think most communities have to worry about these rules as much as their designs are usually very creative & don't rely solely on Niantic logos.
ReplyDeletelike the dude with the TeeSpring tshirts in the Ingress community right now.
ReplyDeleteI would like a more in depth writing and example with pictures of whats permitted or not in a document to make things more clearer.
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteKaren Brown that's what I was hoping to hear/be verified on!
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley what about the BRRN logo?
ReplyDeleteIs this logo ok to use?
ReplyDeletehttp://cr0ybot.github.io/ingress-logos/enlightened_alt.png
Everyone asking detailed questions, click the link and read. It has examples and a lot of words that explain the situation lol
ReplyDeleteAre achievement badges classed as logos or game images? Can they be used as they are or with modification?
ReplyDeleteKaren Brown Would that be a yes or no?
ReplyDeleteNviea Sarriha eh?
ReplyDeleteAnd not to mention, for example, my Avatar that me and a friend made back in August 2014 as backlash to guardian hunters because both of us got our 150d in the centre of Haarlem of all places (the ENL Guardian hunting DB got corrupted i heard since, and they hit the portal on 154 days). Although it wasn't my intention for that black guardian middle finger logo to be of any use to anyone, it was a 5 minute rush job post on G+ to say haha I got my guardian, I win, eventually some cool swag merchants copied the logo off my G+ and turned that into patch, and that patch went viral globally.. It was rather hilarious.
ReplyDeleteIs that now going to come under this grey area?
Legally they have to try to defend their copyright works (AFAIK) otherwise as far as the law's concerned, they have no interest in protecting it.
ReplyDeleteMartin Treadgold I was wondering about the legitimacy of taking the official logo and modifying it slightly. Like the Guardian Badge logo. Adding the middle finger, does it fall under their no copy right guidelines?
ReplyDeleteKaren Brown the TeeSpring guy (Roku). I couldn't tell what way you were going with that comment.
ReplyDeleteCan we just see this as what it is? This shot across the bow is nothing more than a respectful kind of "from this day forward please cease and desist" from a company in regards to their own property. I can understand completely, what if YOU owned the business? And I for one look forward to some really great swag items being mass produced and available GLOBALLY, to ALL of us. Start designing and be ready to submit them instead of crabbing! :)
ReplyDeleteWell either hes blocked me or hes taken it down - cos I can't see the thread any more.
ReplyDeleteI still look forward to communities being able to create their own cool community/anomaly based swag - customising ingress/team/anomaly logos to suit.
ReplyDeleteAnd I also don't see Bio Cards being targeted, WHERE they're personally made. But I do see those making money off making them for others being targeted.
Souk Nomichith yeah thats what i was wondering. Wasn't my intention of it going viral as a patch, but I'm sure you've seen them around though.
ReplyDeleteI'm not a swag merchant, I don't have any control over who is selling it either, but I'd hate to see that be clamped down on. It is one of the more funnier swag patches out there.
And I am rather grateful for the Swag Merchants for picking up on the design, nice job!
Lol guys, I don't give a Fuck about it. I play this game for more that two years.... I will make swag with and without your logos and you won't stop me.... If you start to threaten swag makers, you better chose your company because you will lose many many player!
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley lots of respect for you bro, but you're no PR dept, and whoever asked you to post this knew so too lol
ReplyDeleteIf niantic is going solo as a company then it needs to become more corporate. Unfortunately that does mean protecting logo's and branding and looking at ways to finance improvements to the game. It also means less photos of your dinner and cats (unless it's Saturday)
Michael Butler It's perfectly understandable that they need to protect their IP, now more than ever. In this case it's a matter of the delivery. A "shot across the bow" is something you use with adversaries. With your friends and people that have worked with you to get you where you are, an "explanation" is more customary. In other words a "hey folks here's what we're doing and here's why it's necessary to do it" would have gone a lot better than a "you've been warned" message
ReplyDeleteI blame Obama for this mess
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley i made shirts to memorialize my dad after his passing and i threw a resistance key on it. i did it to rep his avatar and handed them out to friends absorbing the cost myself. where would that leave me
ReplyDeletehmmmmm
ReplyDeleteA lot of the stuff I've been making (especially lately) has been requests from other agents. The line has always been fuzzy in the swag community as far as the key and eye goes. So I figured "well, if they have a problem with one of my designs I'm sure I'll hear about it" lol. The only time I ever had a problem with a design thus far is when I used the name "ingress" in the title of a shirt. But if they wanna start cracking down on them that's fine. Just means I gotta be more creative 😉. And no Karen Brown your not blocked. And the thread is still there
ReplyDeleteRaymond Andrews I take it as a friendly warning. No malice, not from an aversary.
ReplyDeleteI think what Joe Philley is trying to say, is that if you or your company try to make money at expense of using Nia Logos, don't do it without asking Nia if it's Ok. If it's community related items that promote the game, an event, your faction, or local community (not for personal/corporate profit), then should be fine. ;)
ReplyDeleteRoku looks to have been classed as spam then - cos I don't see it.
ReplyDeleteAnything where people make money off it.
ReplyDeleteThing is with community based stuff, its all non-profit. Theres no guise of 'I'm making it for someone who asked' and advertising it everywhere.
I seek community based stuff.... its very cool cos it means something.
Copyright and trademark hell, something that needs to be explained as Niantic goes foreword as an independent company.
ReplyDeletecan't help when google search promotes the unofficial swag over anything legit... oooh thats gotta hurt
ReplyDeleteYou might have to explain that one Martin Treadgold
ReplyDeleteMy feeling is.... Roku and his many other account names will be made an example of. An example of how you shouldn't act with Ingress logos.
ReplyDeleteMost of us are not companies. We are individuals. No point in making an example of companies - that won't mean anything to Joe-Average-Ingressor.
ReplyDeleteIf google search is showing search results of every unofficial swag, rather ironic.. but can't be helped i suppose.. and there's hundreds of these sites out there... How willing is Google to take them out of the search results, that's what I wanna know. Yes It will hurt official swag sales.
ReplyDeleteGoogle search is an automated bot search. Nothing to do with Ingress. I don't get the point.
ReplyDeletethey do have official swag - they're selling the last of it.
ReplyDeleteKaren Brown The sad thing is that Roku has awesome designs (I have 2 awesome shirts from him) and I would love NIA to get some of that money because it's their own works of art. I have seen other people wear his shirts at anomalies I attended so unfortunately, he most likely will be made an example.
ReplyDeleteDouglas Sines lol I try 😳
ReplyDeleteDouglas Sines I won't touch them on principle that they are not licensed and he is very clearly trying to make a profit. And the fact he uses multiple names to advertise them suggests he has been warned to stop.
ReplyDeleteIts a bot search that is designed to promote results, the unintentional outcome of that is that there are hundreds of results of unofficial sites.. type Ingress Shirt into Google for example, you still can end up with the unofficial sites in the results.
ReplyDeletewhich will make it easy for Niantics lawyers to send out cease and desists when the time comes.
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDelete#CommunitySwag4Life
ReplyDeleteI've actually read this policy before, and it doesn't seem to have been updated (except maybe the selection of fair use images?). I just wonder why the share? Did I miss something, or are people just reading into it and making wild assumptions?
ReplyDeleteKaren Brown I don't use multiple names. And have never received any kind of "official warning". Honesty I'm not really worried about it.
ReplyDeleteRoku one of your resistance t shirts was put up using an Indian sound name and was hurriedly taken down again.
ReplyDeleteCan't wait to see how to get permission!
ReplyDeleteMartin Treadgold
ReplyDeleteI was wondering - just how much are those swag sites and fan websites reimbursing Niantic for making money off their property?
20% ? 15%? 5% ?
Or are they keeping all the profit themselves?
You simply can‘t be serious on this...
ReplyDeleteProbably reimburse nothing
ReplyDeleteThe domain of your support page confuses me. Afaik you're no longer part Of Google Inc.?
ReplyDeleteSeriously: I understand that the logos are your trademark and I respect it. But all the agents out there show this logos especially the RES and the ENL logo to the world(and they are pretty cool)
When I wear my ENL shirt, people often ask me about the story behind it. And start playing ingress. The 'official' logos you guys created are.. I don't want to say ugly. But... there is and there will never be a brand recognition. By design.
And the key and the eye will be forgotten soon,l as they are shown almost nowhere. A brand no one knows is a dead brand.
most of your customers Agents identify thmselves with their factions.
I guess your plan is to sell the swag on your own. That's OK. Now that Google's not paying for you any longer you have to make money, somehow.
But then ensure that you have Partnershops around the globe, not only in the US. That the prices stay fair. I am unwilling to pay $40-50 for a shirt plus shipping fee to Europe.
No 'normal' agent who creates Wallpapers, Shirts and so on for their communities is interested in making money with them. Treat those who potentially make money with dices, dog tags key chains or even shirts full of Linkamps, Powercubes. Oh, wait you own one, Joe.
Sure you a NIA employee. But you were happy about it. Weren't you?
These graphics are part if the game and also under the copyright of NIA.
There were 3d printed XMPs, cakes with the logos and you guys were proud about it.
If I would be the owner I'd at least allow the usage of the two faction logos to use them for their own work as long as they don't make money with them. Possibly with a small remark.
Because these are the things that we identify with.
Ourselves & Our factions
Resistance & Enlightened.
Blue & Green.
Key & Eye.
That was OK
For almost three years...
I know you're just the sender of this message so please don't take it personally. But you are Community Manager and should be the 'interface' between NIA and us. In both directions.
The words you've chosen to spread this into the Comm were not the right ones.
/sub
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley I would love to be subscribed.
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteI'm a douche by nature William TNSheep
ReplyDeleteSo try to sell me your stuff, NIA. I won´t buy it! That has been the fun about that whole thing. To be creative and give the blink of a hint by using one of those elements. As far as I see, we´ll just leave those components out. Maybe its fun to have those three symbols somewhere but as long as it is not forbidden to use the words "res(istance)", "enl(ightment)", "smurfs", "frogs" or "Ingress". I don´t see for what reason I would depend on that logos. Make the game commercial and I am out. That is how easy the world is for me.
ReplyDeleteRomain Schmechta
ReplyDeleteSo you promise not to bitch when the servers lag, development slows down, and updates cease, because Niantic isn't making any money?
Niantic isn't a charity.
Karen Brown You seem to be on a witch hunt here, got a personal grievance with Roku?
ReplyDeleteHes someone who is intentionally flaunting the rules.
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley I think it basically translates to (and please if I am Correct me here?) if you're not selling the logos directly. IE- official key/niantic logo/the anomaly badges- Put it on a shirt/lighter/keychain sell it for personal profit, no mods to the existing art = nope. BUT if you incorporate to your local city state town with artistic variation = ok, barring you're not promoting yourself something official/Niantic?
ReplyDeleteAwesome, on the linked site I can still get an activation code if I theme artwork on the Niantic logos. Sweet.
ReplyDeleteYou do remember how this all started, right? We got codes for making ingress swag. Same for capsules when those came out. We were encouraged to use the logos, rewarded for it, and it made us feel like we were more a part of this then other games. Our engagement was high, we felt like there was something that we were a part of. Because it is a lifestyle, right?
I would echo Martin Treadgold's first comment and echo the philosophy of the Grateful dead. Let the brand speak for itself, let the logo stand for something greater then the trademark or copyright. I know you are all here to make money. If you do it right you will.
If you do it wrong, this amazing experiment ends. Not a threat or anything. But I have seen brands that start out open, and try to monetize in the wrong way. They tend to die.
So does it mean that law can be implemented back?
ReplyDeleteKaren Brown and his work is actively being re-shared by Joe Philley AFTER he himself made this announcement. I think you need to let it go and demonstrate your love or hate of things with your dollars, not with attacks on people and what they do.
ReplyDelete"Please refrain from using these trademarks and logos on your websites, social media sites, or on other items in a way that creates confusion."
ReplyDeleteWhich way creates confusion? ;-)
wother ronin
ReplyDeleteBut all of that occurred and allowed when Niantic had Google as a sugar daddy.
That's changed now. Shouldn't Niantic regain control of all of their intellectual property, and then license it as they see fit?
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ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDeleteFor anyone complaining I suggest you spend 12 minutes and lookup trademark law.. Naintic either defends it or loses it.
ReplyDeleteDo you want other games on the market with the same logo?? What would that do to the reputation?
This is not by choice.. Simple matter of fact
It will be nice to see official swag and official licensing for community content creators.
ReplyDeleteAlso, everyone keep in mind that policy is an expression of Niantic's wishes for how their intellectual property be used. It isn't a lesson in trademark and copyright law. They have certain legal protections regardless; this is meant to protect the community and their relationship with it by saying "These are the sorts of things that are okay and fair warning of what we would pursue legal action against."
In your own policy you ask that people don't sell merchandise with any of your artwork .. Yet Joe Philley you have worn a shirt with all the items on it publicly and on Google plus that was not made by niantic or Google. Correct me if I am wrong please because I don't want to sound like an ass... But if I am correct seems a bit hypocritical.
ReplyDelete/ sub
ReplyDelete/interested in the licencing stuff too
ReplyDeleteChris B "They're not coming after your community swag. If you scroll back, you'll see a post where +Joe Philley says as much" Do you speak of a post or a comment here? If first one: can you give me a link please?
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDelete"I'm interested in this," The Long Librarian
ReplyDeleteInteresting first step to say the least.
ReplyDelete/popcorn
ReplyDelete/s
ReplyDeleteTL;DR - get over yourselves and your butthurt. If you're making a profit off of Niantic's intellectual property, stop.
ReplyDeleteQuick, Niantic did something different. Let's all get on social media and bitch and moan about it!
FFS people. Stop with the knee-jerk nerd-rage reaction every time this corporate entity does anything to protect their intellectual property. Stop with the whining and demanding that they make their free game better for you and your personal enjoyment.
Play.
The.
Game.
Or GTFO.
It's a game. It's a lifestyle. It's a product. And it's Niantic's. Not yours. Not mine. Not any of ours.
There isn't enough money in the 'verse (or bacon, for that matter) to make me want Joe Philley's job. Yes, he's done things that may have been ill-advised. But he handles all this whining and complaining BS better than I would (or a majority of the regular commentors in the community).
Seriously? No swag? Even if we aren't reselling it we are paying someone to make stuff like badges and shirts so the screening / stitching company is profiting. Oh well good thing I don't really play anymore. Glad we spent money on first Saturday swag that we now can't sell to Cover costs to people who want swag that isn't offered by Niantic directly.
ReplyDeleteJoe Philleybetter stop all the coin checks. Gonna get nailed for TOS violations after the next update
ReplyDelete/sub
ReplyDelete/sub. it looks like niantic is starting to clarify some things.
ReplyDeleteI look forward to what comes next. And I trust that niantic wants to work with the community and not against it.
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ReplyDelete42
ReplyDeleteChris B, Mick Preston, Karen Brown (and I'm sure a couple others, but I'm lazy and don't want to scroll back up to tag you all), thank you for getting it. Stay classy.
ReplyDeleteYou guys need friends now. Going after your fans is a boneheaded move.
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley (sorry for second tag, I really do want to get it), I'm hoping the final wording will explicitly allow for community logos and such? I know for me, and probably many others out there, "Very easy If it has our logo its a no no" is in opposition to "We aren't trying to crack down on city faction creating shirts to promote themselves (we like that)" Hopefully the final wording clears it up. The way the current guidelines are worded and how you started this post makes it seem that designs - like the SPAIRO logo of a bird with key for chest we created almost three years ago to represent our area's Resistance agents - are done for. Is that not the case?
ReplyDeleteBy the way, thanks for taking time to answer our questions. Can't be easy to deal with Ingress players. Next time you're in Pittsburgh we'll take you to the best bacon purveyors.
Joe Philley sometimes I think you really don't know how many of us are on this side. You said you'll take care of everything, will do all things for everywhere... honestly and not willing to be offensive, it looks like a naive position from you and Niantic Project.
ReplyDeleteYou'll fail, you'll take toons of time to produce, deliver and fulfil all demands and unfortunately will kill the good vibe that the community (not you) created since day 1.
If you think otherwise then look at your portal submission reply delays and your tickets reply delay, and if you think you'll be able to do everything, start with what you already suck at.
Chris B It doesn't have to be that people are either butthurt or stupid. It can just be that after years of Niantic promoting, endorsing, re-sharing, posing with, and otherwise celebrating community made items including the logo's, that they're a bit put off with the suddenness and brevity of a warning on something that's been tacitly allowed at the very least in the past.
ReplyDeleteOmg! How discouraging!
ReplyDeleteChris B And if such statements were codified in a published publicly available policy instead of replies to comments on a post in social media, there would be a little less trepidation in the communities reaction
ReplyDeleteClearly the attorney's haven't had time to draw up all the fine details regarding this topic.
ReplyDeleteI think the takeaway here is, keep making your awesome swag, just please don't copy the logos indicated.
That's pretty straight forward.
I am sure we will get more info soon, I think Joe just wanted to help people avoid spending money making on stuff Niantic wouldn't want out there.
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ReplyDeleteBrad Howard I'm very much interested in any information you can provide on the development of the next version of the client.
ReplyDelete🐾
ReplyDeleteBilly Spettel I'm not butt hurt I'm thinking this is a good step for them to get money on their IP I'm just thinking how getting swag now mat be a problem in the future. Like coin checks...
ReplyDeleteI'm assuming most commenters here didn't read the guidelines shared above?
ReplyDeleteNiantic prohibited the use of the basic Ingress logo, key and eye, but provided permitted "open source" versions of the three.
So fan sites, local community sites, flags, banners, shirts from now on should use the open-source versions and that will be all Ok.
Did I miss something here Joe Philley?
Brad Howard so much yes. +1000
ReplyDeleteJoe Philley To clarify something I can't see in the posts above:
ReplyDeleteCan I go to a Print shop and get them to put the ENL logo on a T-Shirt for me, for my own purposes, to wear? No profit made by me. So that I can have a clearly ENL t-shirt with my name on it.
Is this about reselling the logo, or making things with the logo on it?
It seems like they are allowing distinctly unique location and/or group art inspired by the original artwork. What is not OK is an attempt to duplicate or outright copy official swag like pins or badges. Player cards for example should be fine because agent redsolocup is not an official character card being duplicated. Anomaly T-shirts are derived from, but not an outright copy, of the official swag faction shirts. You just can't start selling stand alone eye and key stickers. Why? Niantic already does. I'm OK with this.
ReplyDeleteAll the images still say copyright Google 2012
ReplyDeleteAndrew Krug Given that the only "merchandise store" Niantic has is either the Google one, which I imagine is closing given all the price reductions and "limited supply", or the We Love Fine one which does't even feature a piece of clothing with the ENL logo except for a tiny one in the Guardian logo and those that do contain the actual logo (pins) are "almost sold out", this is being heavily mishandled by Niantic.
ReplyDeleteIngress John Hanke Launch your new store, get people excited, then tell people to stand down on their own. I'd like one of every anomaly patch, but I haven't bought from existing suppliers because they've been of varying quality. But I can't buy from you, because... you don't have any store?????
Joe Philley, every swag adventure I've been involved with benefitted a charity #missionsforgood. I hope we will still be allowed to sell swag containing the logo incorporated into original art when the proceeds are for charity. We fed 19,013 people in South Hampton Roads over the holidays, supported Richmond Storefront, bike Richmond and DC ferrals with proceeds from swag sales.
ReplyDeleteBrent Hollett also anomaly packages and swag like what was available during Persepolis. And - just because official swag isn't available now for purchase doesn't mean individuals creating replica pins and patches for previously official sold or created gear is be any less counterfeit. It would be really easy to make counterfeit character cards for example and trade them online. They have to draw the line in the sand somehow.
ReplyDeleteI would imagine the repro anomaly pins would be first on the chopping block here. Glad I snagged some.
ReplyDeleteAndrew Krug This is the 21st century when printing a T-shirt costs $15 for a one off. If they seriously expect to hold to their requirements, they cannot just half-arse it at this point. People will stop caring and the situation will get worse not better.
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't be surprised if people stop offering merch and start selling patterns, which people take to their own print shop. Which ones infringe on this will be anyone's guess.
People want this merchandise. If Ingress won't or can't supply it, people will bootleg it, just like any other thing in the world since... ever. All this does is drive the swag merchants underground, and we saw how well that worked for Prohibition.
Do people need to get (R) or TM s added to their tattoos too? And perhaps follow a yet undefined process to license the work?
ReplyDelete